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Wesley
Trade Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 10:57 pm |
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If it was a Mondeo,
Then I think the front subframe mounts are within the prescribed area of the Front of the outer sills? Or is that Escorts?
As for the Rear of the Sills, You Advised Him of this Issue 5, Yes Five Months Ago! The Book of Appeals is only Three Months.
If He Was a Good Guy, Then He Would have seen sense and Resolved it at time of The Original Test.
Not Your Problem!
Regards, Wes.
Last edited on Mon Nov 26th, 2007 11:15 pm by Wesley
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Rebel
Trade Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 10:04 pm |
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AAh, that makes sense then.
I prefer the old days when the whole sills were testable.
Everybody knew where they stood then.
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kev1975
Trade Member
| Joined: | Wed Sep 5th, 2007 |
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 09:56 pm |
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| i should have been a bit clearer with that , it wasn't right at the front of the cill but in a seat belt prescribed area, sort of half way along the front door.
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Rebel
Trade Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 09:08 pm |
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"i failed it on corrosion at the front of 1 of the cills"
Kev - which prescribed area did you fail this on?
I've had several cars with rot and holes at the front end of the sills but had to pass and advise, due to not being within a prescribed area.
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kev1975
Trade Member
| Joined: | Wed Sep 5th, 2007 |
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 08:45 pm |
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i have just had a local trader complining to me today , he brought an r reg mondeo in for test back in june , i failed it on corrosion at the front of 1 of the cills , knackered discs & pads & a few other bits & bobs , an advisory was issued at the time for a few items including corrosion at the rear of the cills .
today he has finally sold it & the buyer wants a full mot although the car has only done 4 miles since its last test , the only thing it failed on was the rear of both cills , they were quite rotten by now .
he was less than impressed that the car had only done 4 miles since last mot & now failed another mot .
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volksjim
Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 07:53 pm |
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nicknak wrote: The vt 32 is the most important document you will ever issue, you issue it to cover yourself, who cares if its not given to the customer by the salesman.
thats a big big defo always issue at vt32 "advisory" if something is marginal it covers your bahookie as it lets VOSA know that you picked up a fault at time of test..i too do a lot of trade vehicles and have never ever had any complaints..it does state on the vt20"pass certificate" advisory issued yes/no
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nicknak
Trade Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 06:29 pm |
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The vt 32 is the most important document you will ever issue, you issue it to cover yourself, who cares if its not given to the customer by the salesman.
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clayhead
Member
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Posted: Mon Nov 26th, 2007 06:22 pm |
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i got a curious look from my ve when i told him we dont issue many advisories as we do a lot of trade test work and i would rather the traders went elsewhere than have buyers screaming at me a couple of months after buying a car which needed some work doing on the brakes.so far ive had two vehicles come to my place complaining about the car they had recently bought neither were given the 32 
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volksjim
Member
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Posted: Wed Nov 21st, 2007 10:25 pm |
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so true i failed front discs on a toyota avensis that were tbh totally knackered..ie out of the full inner brake surface about 5mm of the disc was shiny indicating where the inner pad is working....got cautioned from local vi guy for failing them..i replied in my defence that the discs will be subject to a toyota warranty claim..his face turned white... then he said" ok then i will just give you a verbal caution"..can't win!!! oh the discs were replaced under warranty no probs
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Daz
Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 20th, 2007 08:20 pm |
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MOTman wrote:
VOSA tell testers to put their 'MoT hat' on and not their 'service hat', hence we have situations like this.
Couldnt agree with that any more...
Have had many a diagreement with Guys who dont test in our service dept..Most of the stuff that i would advise as being slightly worn/has slight play etc, they would consider as it needs replacing from a servicing point of view.
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MOTman
Super Moderator
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Posted: Tue Nov 20th, 2007 10:28 am |
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Just thought I'd add a post to this interesting one.
The poor MoT tester can never win. I've seen testers taken to task by VOSA for failing brake discs when VOSA decree that there was plenty of life in the discs still!
VOSA tell testers to put their 'MoT hat' on and not their 'service hat', hence we have situations like this.
You may like to know that VOSA were originally going to make the advisory comments annotated within the pass or fail certificate. Had they gone ahead this may well have prevented many scenarios such as this.
On the other side of the coin and to defend the trader here, just how many of us will sell our vehicles and give the advisory certificate to the prospective purchaser? Not too many I guess!
VOSA will defend their whole administration of their MoT scheme by stating that the VOSA web site can be checked by prospective purchasers for this very information, which of course you can, but in reality we all know that most of us punters will not go to such lengths when looking at second hand cars.............
As the brakes passed the roller brake test efficiency readings and they're not causing you any concern ie squeaks/grating noises etc, I would guess they have plenty of life in them yet. A 2nd opinion may help you decide (ie another garage/mechanic) whether to waste your money on unnecessary repairs.
It's your shout, but if the tester had advised on all the tyres being 3mm (which he's allowed to do- fail is 1.6mm), would you be thinking of changing the tyres to new ones or expect the trader to put new ones on for you? I'm not being facetious but just trying to get across the message that testers have a difficult job to do and some times can't do right for doing wrong.
Good luck.
Last edited on Tue Nov 20th, 2007 10:29 am by MOTman
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motmac
Member
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Posted: Tue Nov 20th, 2007 12:27 am |
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safedriver wrote: Not taking it any further, spoke to vosa and it seems theres a lot of bad guys out there, but they are hard to catch.
The trader was in the wrong for not giving me the advisory notice upon purchase of the car.I will be replacing the discs myself which should have been done.
In my opinion i feel as though the mot is not stringent enough to keep cars safely on the road. I have drove cars for 30 years and seen cars mistreat by the owner of the vehicle to shocking degrees. They are not kept road worthy hence there is far too many accidents and breakdowns.
They should either abolish the mot for what it is worth and vosa do spot checks or make it so you have a mot more often at less price and more to specific standards , not just minimum as this cannot be defined.
A high percentage of people who drive on the roads today do not know how to clean a car never mind going into maintaining a car fit for the road. Even a lot of sales blokes know nothing about advising customers about cars and how to look after them when purchasing .
Just like to say i will be more carefull when purchasing next time, and between you and me i think i will go for a brand new one with no mot's to worry about and a warranty.
Thanks for your help and opnions guys it was much appreciated.
So then,your still convinced that you were ripped off.....i'd like you to post some pictures of these brake discs so that MOT testers can give you an opinion of their condition.it may be the case that they dont need changing yet, thus saving you money??? i'd really like to see a pic of these discs if you could be so kind
My point is that MOT testers have variations of judgment and with this in mind i think a simple inspection of these discs may prove my point.
I agree that the car dealer should have given you the advisory note, but tbh it could be the case that an advisory notice wasnt necessary and the dealer didnt want to swap them for no good reason.in my opinion that doesnt make him a criminal and so i think a little common sense should come into play.
If these discs look knackered then i'll be the first to condem them
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safedriver
Member
| Joined: | Fri Nov 16th, 2007 |
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Posted: Mon Nov 19th, 2007 08:51 pm |
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Not taking it any further, spoke to vosa and it seems theres a lot of bad guys out there, but they are hard to catch.
The trader was in the wrong for not giving me the advisory notice upon purchase of the car.I will be replacing the discs myself which should have been done.
In my opinion i feel as though the mot is not stringent enough to keep cars safely on the road. I have drove cars for 30 years and seen cars mistreat by the owner of the vehicle to shocking degrees. They are not kept road worthy hence there is far too many accidents and breakdowns.
They should either abolish the mot for what it is worth and vosa do spot checks or make it so you have a mot more often at less price and more to specific standards , not just minimum as this cannot be defined.
A high percentage of people who drive on the roads today do not know how to clean a car never mind going into maintaining a car fit for the road. Even a lot of sales blokes know nothing about advising customers about cars and how to look after them when purchasing .
Just like to say i will be more carefull when purchasing next time, and between you and me i think i will go for a brand new one with no mot's to worry about and a warranty.
Thanks for your help and opnions guys it was much appreciated.
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kev1975
Trade Member
| Joined: | Wed Sep 5th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 322 |
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 07:54 pm |
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the spare tyre is not part of the test & wiper blades are not a fail if they are split , they would fail if they are insecure , don't clear the screen effectively , or are not big enough to give adequate view etc etc .
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motmac
Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 05:15 pm |
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I agree with KevG.the MOT station has done nothing wrong if the brake discs are slightly scored and they passed and advised it.whats the point of changing brake discs that have plenty of service life in them? the advisory notice is there just to advise you of the general condition of items and doesnt mean that they need changing.
I think you aught to give the garage the benifit of the doubt rather than jumping to the conclusion that you have been ripped off.in the same way you get sick of feeling ripped off,garages like myself get sick of being accused of it for no good reason!go and talk to the guy who sold you the car in a reasonable frame of mind and you may be pleasantly suprised.
Last edited on Sun Nov 18th, 2007 05:17 pm by motmac
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KevG
Super Moderator
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 04:17 pm |
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As has been said earlier in this thread the MOT is the MINIMUM standard.
The "Repairs" you need are service items and as the driver of the vehicle its your responsibility to keep it serviced.
The Car/MOT is not dodgy, sounds like its been done by the book to me, take the matter up with the garage you purchased the car from. They might change the parts for you if you go about it the right way.
By the way the spare wheel/tyre is not part of the MOT test.
Kev
Last edited on Sun Nov 18th, 2007 04:21 pm by KevG
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safedriver
Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 04:08 pm |
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I was not given the advisory notice upon purchase of the vehicle and found the information on the vosa website. If i had been given the advisory notice (which i was not aware of at the time) i could have looked at the discs before driving it away. I trusted the trader.
So are you trying to say it is my fault i have bought a dodgy vehicle?
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clayhead
Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 03:21 pm |
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caveat emptor!! your issue is with the trader not the garage,if you are unhappy then by all means get vosa involved but if you were aware that an advisory notice was issued you should have checked the items yourself before buying the vehicle. thats what the 32 is there for.
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safedriver
Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 02:43 pm |
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Thanks Kev will do, i will let you know the outcome .
Its frustrating when you pay good money for a car to find somethings not right and you end up paying for the jobs to be done what the sales bloke should have paid for to get it through the test.
Who pays for the repairs then mot station or car sales bloke? as i can see the sales bloke may have said "get it me through test its sold already and i don't want to spend anything on it". The sales pitch and mot tester are good friends and go back to school days.
All this suspicion started when i found out that the trading standards logo that was being advertised on the sales pitch advert was fake. I have already replaced worn wiper blades and a faulty valve in the spare tyre because it was flat after it had been mot'd .
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kev1975
Trade Member
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Posted: Sun Nov 18th, 2007 12:59 am |
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that is not very often the case , what you need to remember is that the mot is of a minimum standard & most parts would have to be absolutely knackered to result in a fail .
the way it was described to us on the training course was on a scale of 1 to 10 , 10 is a new car , 7 is the approximate standard that a well serviced & maintained vehicle would be , 1 is scrap & the mot standard is between 2 & 3.
before going down the road of vosa why not go to the garage in question & make your feelings known.
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