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volksjim
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 17th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 104 |
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Posted: Sun Jul 6th, 2008 10:22 am |
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keithd wrote: It is great news indeed but I fear now vosa may keep a very close eye on Jim  it's like trying to be clever with a copper, makes you a marked man!
sad to say bud but so very true..gota feeling this aint over yet...got myself a digi cam for future refusal to test motors..thanx peeps for all the great comments
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keithd
Member
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Posted: Fri Jul 4th, 2008 04:56 pm |
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| It is great news indeed but I fear now vosa may keep a very close eye on Jim it's like trying to be clever with a copper, makes you a marked man!
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Spunkymonkey
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| Joined: | Fri Jun 13th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 35 |
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Posted: Fri Jul 4th, 2008 02:57 pm |
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Great news Jim
This is exactly the sort of thing that I've meant on other threads where a tester's judgement shouldn't be questioned unless it's consistently and clearly unreasonable.
From what you've said in this case, not only was your judgement reasonable, by refusing to test you were potentially helping the customer save a wasted test fee - so it could hardly be seen as an attempt to rip him off!
In such a case there is no way that you should have faced disciplinary action for refusing - ultimately, if you're not happy it's safe to test then you shouldn't test. That's covered by Health and Safety rather than road law and isn't (or shouldn't be) in VOSA's remit.
Just out of interest, I assume when testing you're acting as an agent of VOSA? If so, it could be argued that they were liable for any injury that you sustained because they'd "pressurised" you into taking H&S risks by behaving like this. Certainly, if a direct employer disciplined you for refusing to take an unacceptable risk they'd be liable for all sorts of problems.
Next time (hopefully there won't be one) maybe photograph the evidence and, when they start disciplinary proceedings, make a complaing yourself to the HSE. Just cos it's "their scheme" doesn't exempt them from other law 
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removalizer
Trade Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 80 |
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Posted: Fri Jul 4th, 2008 11:32 am |
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Well done glad to see there is a god, I hope that VE gets a b*****g for messing you about
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big..E.
Trade Member
| Joined: | Tue Jan 29th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 218 |
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Posted: Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 09:26 pm |
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| Jim put this one in the "experience gained tray"..Right outcome at the end "SUPERB"..
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Johnboy
Member
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Posted: Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 09:06 pm |
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| NICE ONE
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keithd
Member
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Posted: Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 07:34 pm |
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| Well done Jim thats excellant news.
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volksjim
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 17th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 104 |
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Posted: Thu Jul 3rd, 2008 06:57 pm |
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yeee haaaa!!!!won my appeal.....just a pity all this could have been avoided if common sense had been applied by ve to start with still onwards and hopefully upwards
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kev1975
Trade Member
| Joined: | Tue Sep 4th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 250 |
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Posted: Mon Jun 9th, 2008 07:34 pm |
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removalizer wrote: So what did the trader say ? did he pay for the repair ?
not much he could say , he just had to bite the bullet & pay for the repair (we don't do his repairs anyway) .
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removalizer
Trade Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 80 |
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Posted: Mon Jun 9th, 2008 07:51 am |
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So what did the trader say ? did he pay for the repair ?
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kev1975
Trade Member
| Joined: | Tue Sep 4th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 250 |
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Posted: Sat Jun 7th, 2008 11:06 pm |
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i had a little incident last week after i had tested a traders car .
finished the test & did the paperwork (fail) , then reversed the car out of the testing bay .
had to stop as someone was driving past , i had been sat for a few seconds with the engine idling & it cut out .
thought it was probably out of fuel , tried to start it & got the distinct sound of an engine with no compression .
yup , timing belt snapped & bent some valves .
the engine gave no indication of the impending failure , no noises or anything , just cut out.
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RFR
Member
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Posted: Sat Jun 7th, 2008 10:57 pm |
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Hi Rem,
Are these not two different things .
If you ask a customer to sign a disclaimer outside of the MOT that is up to you, nothing to do with VOSA.
If you ask a customer to sign a disclaimer to cover the vehicle while in test then it is because the law says you cannot. re Testing Guide.
So if you did use a disclaimer for the MOT and you could fight a claim and win then that is great, however VOSA could start the disciplinary process going, for the disclaimer, possibility it could get binned anyway for it could be seen as an illegal act in the first place.
Finally
"Anyone who reads this accepts my disclaimer, in that "I maybe wrong"
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removalizer
Trade Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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Posted: Sat Jun 7th, 2008 08:18 pm |
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keithd wrote: I don't think you can get the customer to sign a disclaimer. I remember this being talked about at the time when the DSM test was brought in. Just as you have no power to stop them driving away from the VTS with a vehicle you've issued a VT30 with a dangerous to drive.
They told me this on the course i went on as well, but it was only their opinion in other words VOSA would not back you up in court, I wouldn't want those bunch of back stabbers backing me anyway and take my chances with the judge on the day, I have a lot of experiance with courts and 9 times out of ten I win on customers signing agreements, as most judges possess common sense unlike VOSA.
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volksjim
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| Joined: | Sat Nov 17th, 2007 |
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| Posts: | 104 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 6th, 2008 08:42 pm |
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cheers wes mate cant get a punter to sign a disclaimer as this brings testing scheme into disrepute anyhoo got a job interview on monday...back to the nuts and bolts more money less hours and no hassle from vosa hopefully..win lose or draw can't see myself testing much longer...way far too much politics in mot's nowadays....screw road safety lets see how much we can earn for the govt. sorry but not me anymore
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keithd
Member
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Posted: Fri Jun 6th, 2008 07:54 pm |
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I don't think you can get the customer to sign a disclaimer. I remember this being talked about at the time when the DSM test was brought in. Just as you have no power to stop them driving away from the VTS with a vehicle you've issued a VT30 with a dangerous to drive.
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removalizer
Trade Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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Posted: Fri Jun 6th, 2008 03:42 pm |
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volksjim wrote: removalizer wrote: I must admit I woouldn't do a refusal to test on sharp edges I would just do the test and fail it, but I'm different being a sole trader and the only tester, It wouldn't be in my interest to wind customers up.
what about fibre glass on rear chassis where axle bolts onto don't want to rip axle off during brake test which could leave you wide open
I think it would have done that before it arrived at the test station, however if I saw something like that I would get the customer back in and inform him of the dangers of carrying out the test and would he like me to carry on or even sign a disclaimer.
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Wesley
Trade Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 5th, 2008 09:41 pm |
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volksjim wrote: Wesley wrote: very interesting, I beleive (Over Exuberance) Might come Into Play?
i hope you don't mean on my behalf?!!
I didn`t mean you, another quote they use when it`s in their favour is Over Zealous.
Wes.
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keithd
Member
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Posted: Thu Jun 5th, 2008 06:03 am |
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I would argue the case, reading the lastest special notice they say once again in bold text a tester has the right to refuse to test if they thinks there is a danger etc. Just because VE man (ex baker) does not agree that doesn't make it right.
Why give us the option of refusal to test in the first place if decissions overturned by someone else with little experience.
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volksjim
Member
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| Posts: | 104 |
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Posted: Tue Jun 3rd, 2008 08:55 pm |
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removalizer wrote: I must admit I woouldn't do a refusal to test on sharp edges I would just do the test and fail it, but I'm different being a sole trader and the only tester, It wouldn't be in my interest to wind customers up.
what about fibre glass on rear chassis where axle bolts onto don't want to rip axle off during brake test which could leave you wide open
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removalizer
Trade Member
| Joined: | Mon Feb 11th, 2008 |
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| Posts: | 80 |
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Posted: Mon Jun 2nd, 2008 11:12 am |
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I must admit I woouldn't do a refusal to test on sharp edges I would just do the test and fail it, but I'm different being a sole trader and the only tester, It wouldn't be in my interest to wind customers up.
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